I think you have mistaken this place for the warrior forum.

JohnRoy, Why don't I understand even one teenie-tiny bit of what you are trying to say?

Which spinner do you use

I use an ancient "spinner" that's been used for ages- my brain.

Why?

Because I value hand-crafted value over mass- and machine-produced junk.

I find it strange to see this post in the content, writing and copyright forum. It's not real content or writing, and really disrespectful of others' copyrights.

It's not real content or writing, and really disrespectful of others' copyrights.

Not necessarily, especially after panda.

Imagine that you sold widgets of all shapes and sizes, each widget is powered by a common component.

You have carefully written an informative description for the square widgets power source but now have to think about the other 20 widgets that are driven by this component.

You either copy paste and risk the wrath of G, or try and make each product description unique.

@evdcats - google "content spinner". 12 million results.

@LifeinAsia - You write web content with pen and paper? Mine is machine (computer) produced.

@Koan - seems I missed a point. It's real content and my own writing, just twisted to the limit that would keep it meaningful.

Since most spinners out there unfortunately produce low quality stuff - I asked Which spinner do you use, and Why?

I actually do use pen and paper for notes sometimes. I use a computer too. But my brain decides the words to use, not the computer.

Well I will bite, I am sure you can locate article spinners for yourself though on the web.

I use a program called 'the best spinner', it is probably one of the best spinners out there, to be honest, even this program produces junk if left to it's own devices - ie using the auto spin settings, using it the other way - manually selecting the words it recommends tends to take just as long as writing something from scratch, so if I value the site I would not use it.

Another point is that detecting spun content is one of the things a computer is very good at, so I believe that Google has this one well screwed down. Even a basic Copyscape pass spots most spinning and to think that the search engines are not using something better is naive.

It has it's uses if you want a quick site throwing up for backlinks though.

driller41, you drilled it down perfectly well.

I didn't mention that program, although I've been aware of it. I tend not to judge anything just because it's name is the best ;)

manually selecting the words it recommends tends to take just as long as writing something from scratch

Depends how many versions you want.

If you need 3 copies - it's easier to rewrite it.

If you need several of them, it's easier to spin. Add manual suggestions for {almost each | nearly every} word, hit spin, and review each version for grammar.

~~

You're correct, almost.

Even a basic Copyscape pass spots most [automatic] spinning

This is where a spinner tool comes into the picture.

Another twist.
Another reason where a spinner tool might be of help.

link building!

Assume your site/page gets attention from colleagues who are willing to point to that url with an in text link.

So you need 50 {snippets | paragraphs | sentences | data chunks} of 100-200 words, themed to your original content.

The basics of those mini-articles are the same. With a spinner you twist the words and avoid the duplicate filter.

Now back to the original question ;):

Which spinner and why.

I have to say "an emphatic none" because the web has enough spun crap polluting it already .

I presume you monetize the output with adsense or similar or aff links.

There are as many different variations of crottes as there are bestioles ..spun fewmets are like polished guano .they are still just a variant of kaoc'h.

I didn't need a spinner for that line just vocabulary ,imagination, inventiveness, and a little humor ..and it would beat the crap out of any spun paska on the same subject as regards incoming linkbait on the subject ( and gets past the filters ;-) which a spinner laid sentence wouldn't.

So you need 50 {snippets | paragraphs | sentences | data chunks} of 100-200 words, themed to your original content.

If you can't do that without a spinner ..then what you are putting out is all of the things and more that I mentioned ( and I could have gone on in a similar vein on any subject for hundreds of words ) and as such shouldn't be existing on the net.

Like ersatz coffee and powdered eggs ..spun articles are offensive to the eye and the palate and all the sensibilities .

Do it with your hands your head and your heart ..or don't do it.

Take a pride in what you do ..don't just take the money. ;-)

@Leosghost, seems you used a junk spinner for your post :)

Do it with your hands your head and your heart ..or don't do it.

I would rather follow another quote seen here lately
work smart, not hard

That wasn't hard work at all..;-)
Just needed these,

vocabulary ,imagination, inventiveness,
and a little humor..

and 60 seconds.

Although I suppose,
If you don't have any of them.
You could always,
code your own spinner,
if you can,
but if you can't,
you'd have to ask,
which one was best?

It must seem hard.;-)

"I would rather follow another quote seen here lately work smart, not hard"

How smart is it not to have a decent site that has a chance to weather Google updates? If you are a college student and need pocket money is one thing, hoping to support your family 5 years down the line, another.

@walkman, good question!

Please see post#:4282199 by burcot where a spinner for a decent site might come in handy.

Furthermore, 2 more options were mentioned above:

Stuff for mini sites. Spin the content, review it manually. Get some links. Add some ads. Repeat.

Content for link text (surrounding the url).

I am wondering,
is it a koinkydink,
the timing,
of your post,
and your question,
did your krappatiller,
that spun your sites,
so silkily and smooth,
get eaten,
by a Panda ...
Is it panic , +1 to Matt ;-)

Spin the content, review it manually.

I actually worked on a project with a "spinner" with the idea that editors would manually edit the crap- er, output. The editors said that most of the time it was easier/faster to just write the snippets from scratch instead of trying to fix the muck that was presented to them- echoing what I'd been saying since the beginning of the project.

I be not use harder spinner h**dia diet ;)

I've got mail. Here it is.

One of the things I'm often bothered by about WW is the elitist, web blue blood, professorial posturing you see all too often. I go back to when "affiliate" was a dirty word around here.

Anyhow, I make liberal use of The Best Spinner. Of all the mediocre stuff [they] tried to foist on the unsuspecting, it's one tool that's a standout.

I outsource maybe five or six articles for the niche I'm targeting [=original content!], then I spin them, toss up a WordPress site with [money ads] and then clone it using spun content to avoid dupes.

I use some care in spinning to make sure it all reads well, i.e. I don't just rely on the auto features.

I get a lot of mileage out of well spun content.

Oh, the horror of it all!

I almost forgot saying to this no-nonsense, yet caring and compassionate forum member, Thanks!

This thread was started with a straight-forward question.

Not too many responded (yet) which spinner they use.

Some went out against the use of any spinner for any reason whatsoever.

I felt a desire to show the other side of the story.
_{Looked up that old WW robots.txt blog and didn't find it.
Thanks [replay.waybackmachine.org...] got it.}
Spun 100 versions.
It was not edited/reviewed.
Took about 25 minutes to handle.
Make the calculation.

---

Wavers - Webmasters That Rode Internet giant Affiliates Wave

<sub>(Based on posts in the Robot blog, 5/18/06 Copyright by WebMasterWorld.com Webmaster / Original was found at Internet Archive)

A good many associates were actually questioning if there had been a certain over-abundance with unsatisfied Big G users recently ?!

Making use of the Google wave for an entire crowd of novices was simple. These folks cracked the Google code ;) During the beginning of Goog, anyone would certainly adequately sum up 80% of the Google algorithm using this method ;)


The SE giant rating chart = Obtain One way links = Fine Ranks

That was just the Search engine marketing capability of an entire generation of goog Wave Web administrators (I'd call the group "The big g Wavers" or perhaps just "Wavers").

The whole Web optimization know how out there at this time is focused on one way links. From businesses that offer hyperlinks, toward web-sites that will trade a link, there is certainly a sizeable interest in "backlinks = traffic". So huge, that perhaps way beyond connection as SEO is extinct and obscured, there could very well continue to remain those people advertising it as the end-all-be-all of Advertising and marketing to create coin on it.


So what happens with all these kind of Wavers that will think Getting Backlinks = Web optimization once that great deal of the Google algo is actually devalued in various directions? Wavers set up their prior fortunes on "networks = seo". The moment that process is going off, these Wavers will have zero to hang onto.


What they could do – might be groan. An whole development of experts might be forced to return to SEO School to check out what they skipped over or even hardly had the endurance plus sensation to master.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Wavers - Webmasters That Took Part In Google Links Wave

(Spun from the Robot BB, 5/18/06 Copyright by By the WebMaster of WebMaster World dot com / Source: Internet Archive)

A number of associates have been questioning if there actually appeared to be some kind of over-abundance with upset Bing users recently ?!


Riding the Google wave for an entire crowd of starters seemed to be uncomplicated. These folks cracked the goo algo :-) For the premature of The search engine giant, one could easily figure up eighty percents of the Search engine algorithm this way ;)


Google the giant rating chart = Get hold of One way links = Good Rankings

That was just the Optimization know-how of a whole bunch of g Wave Web administrators (My spouse would call the group "Yahoo Wavers" or even just "Wavers").

Most of the Website placement wisdom out there nowadays is centered on backlinks. Starting from services that provide linking, to services that will place links, we have a huge field in "one way links = traffic". So huge, that even for ages later on when network as SEO would be useless as well as obscured, there will yet remain those individuals trumpeting it to be the ultimate of SEO to create token out of this situation.


Precisely what happens with everyone of these kind of Wavers that think that Receiving One way links = Optimization after that absolute majority regarding the G algorithm is devalued in many manners? Wavers developed their prior accomplishments using "one way links = SEO". The moment that method passes away, short term Wavers will have naught to hold upon.


Just about all they can perform – is grumble. That whole development of experts are pushed to come back to Web School and learn what they neglected or even hardly had the devotion plus passion to learn.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Wavers - Participants That Took Part In Big G Backlinks Wave

(ReWritten from the Robot BB, 18.05.06 Copyright by B Tabke, WebmasterWorld / Source: waybackmachine.org)

A good many friends have been inquiring if there actually was a certain lots of abundance with disappointed users of Yahoo these days ?


Riding the Big G wave for an entire crowd of beginners seemed to be simple. These people banged the goo rating chart ;) During the early stages of The search engine giant, users would be able to easily sum up eighty percents of the Google algorithm using this method :-)


Google rating chart = Obtain One way links = Good Rankings

That has been the Seo optimization know-how of a whole generation of goog Wave Webmasters (I'd call the group "Google the giant Wavers" or just "Wavers").

The majority of the Website placement know how out there today is mostly about affiliate links. Starting from providers that offer hyperlinks, toward websites that can trade links, there's a tremendous market in "one way links = seo". So huge, that maybe even way after linkage as SEO is deceased, there actually would continue to remain those advertising it as the never ending secret of SEO to create coin on the idea.


What occurs with all those Wavers that will think Buying Web links = Seo optimization after that majority from the Google algo becomes depreciated in various directions? Wavers designed their fortunes using "link bait = top traffic". In the event that goes away, short term Wavers remain with nothing to hold upon.


Just about all they might do – will be groan. That entire development of webmasters remain forced to come back on the way to SEO101 and listen to the things they brushed off or hardly had the patience plus zest to be trained.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Wavers - Webmasters That Rode Goog Get links Wave

(Spun from the robots.txt BB, May '06 Copyright by B Tabke, WebmasterWorld / Original was found at archive.org)

A lot of clients have been wondering whether presently there was an lots of abundance of dissatisfied Google users these days ?


Riding the Big G wave for an entire host of newbies was painless. These people banged the Google secret :-) For the beginning years of Goog, anyone could actually effectively sum up the main part of the Big G algorithm by working on this :)


The search engine giants rating chart = Obtain Hyperlinks = Better Rankings

That was the SEO skill of an entire mass of g Wave Web administrators (I'd call them "The search engine giant Wavers" or even just "Wavers").

The majority of the Website placement knowledge around nowadays is about backlinks. From service providers that provide linking, toward websites that can place backlinks, we have a big interest in "links = seo optimisation". So big, that maybe even long after linkage as SEO is extinct and obscured, there will continue to be those people advertising it to be the never ending secret of SEO to make gold coin off this.


So what is happening with everyone of these kind of Wavers that can guess Obtaining Links = Web optimization after that majority within G algo will be devalued in numerous directions? Wavers built their accomplishments using "one way links = top traffic". After that passes off, these Wavers have got zilch to hang onto.


Just about all they may be able to accomplish – will be complain. An entire development of webmasters might be pushed to come back to Web School and learn what they ignored or hardly had the commitment with feeling to be taught.</sub>

If you feed a dog enough food he'll spin lots of unique content on your lawn, but I certainly wouldn't call it quality content, nor would I call this anything but spamming the index.

Note the similarity in the words spinning and spamming :)

I get why people do it, it's an easy path to fast money, but why would you want customers landing on pages that read like dog droppings?

Money valued over content, don't care about customer or impression you make, only money.

Gotcha.

I will admit the thesaurus tools in the spinners kinda rock, but at the end of the day you're still building a house of cards that Google can theoretically detect and knock down.

Wouldn't you prefer to be able to leverage all that unique content in the end instead of getting it devalued along with all the spun content?

Probably not.

Bottom line, for now it is working SMART and NOT HARD! Kudos on that!

If you're really working smart you'll have your spun crap so far distanced from the real deal you won't lose it when it hits the fan, but that's going to be tough, because I'm not sure Google will buy Shaggy's old line "It wasn't me!"

I get why people do it, it's an easy path to fast money, but why would you want customers landing on pages that read like dog droppings?

Money valued over content, don't care about customer or impression you make, only money.

As mentioned above the examples posted came right off the spinner.
They did not go through a human editor.

Stuff that is actually used (after touchups) looks much much better (not only in terms of uniqueness, but in quality).

The spinner is basically a tool. Sorts of the computer that replaced the typewriter, which replaced the pen and paper. It can be used to help the writer.

Wouldn't you prefer to be able to leverage all that unique content in the end instead of getting it devalued along with all the spun content?

Good question.

Caution is always needed.

However, any story that hits the ap/reuters news desk, gets a (human) spin and "Google News" shows them all. If the spinner (tool) is used 'smart', its edited material can come out better than hand+brain+heart written stuff.

RE: have a decent site that has a chance to weather Google updates

This is a little off topic, but might be of some interest in this discussion.

By the time I reached the goal to rank in AltaVista, Google took over.

I survived because half the income was not involved nor related.

Then I rode the wave of Google for a while. Until they penalized anybody using the methods an outsourced 'seo specialist' did without my permission (=bulletin board spamming).

I survived because 70% of the income was not involved nor related.

A nice fortune was spent on a broad niche which skyrocketed for a very long time. The content was unique excellent quality. The keywords were based on misspelled words. Until Google and the others implemented the serps to show the correct spelling instead.

I survived because 80% the income was not involved nor related.

I'm aware of the panda update only because it's mentioned here. Even if some of the sites would be effected, I would've survive because 90% the income is not involved nor related.

I diversify.

Fair play to you, I know these have been discussed for years and I'm sure people still use them, albeit I would imagine they are less effective (or Google is more selective).

I'd guess that anyone that is using spun content, probably wouldn't want to share, it's going to lessen the chances of their content passing the grade IMO.

Obviously this kind of topic is always going to get flak as it's probably a grade lower than user comments ;o)

Have you considered creating your own?

>> Have you considered creating your own?
Yes. Actually have one.

But if you built your second pc it does not necessarily mandate you shouldn't get a new dell.

Money valued over content,

What's so hoity toity about content. It's frikkin content. Heck, 95% of the handwritten stuff in my industry is crap. My articles spun would be better than most others' original articles. There's nothing redeeming about stupid people writing poor content just because it was done by a person. And the bulk of the handwritten content out there is garbage.

Money, that I can translate into something I can eat.

Can we not be so virtuous about how others earn a living?

Frankly, I'd like to see a bit more of this kind of stuff around here. I can use it to get ideas on how to do quality stuff, better.

Building links through tons of press releases and article submissions is crap IMO. But I'm 'spinning' that idea into something that I'm quite happy with from a quality perspective. If I hadn't looked at article submissions, I'd not have come up with what I'm working on.

I'm sort of reminded that A students become professors, B students become consultants and C students make all the money. In our game, C students aren't bothered by disseminating less than Pulitzer level content, spun to sidestep duplication and regurgitated to play the numbers game, as long as it makes money today, this week or this month. Five years from now, Google might kick all the C students into purgatory or worse, but it ain't doing so today.

For my part, I have some professorial quality stuff out there (for over ten years), some B student stuff along with C type, mill run money machines. Diversification spells wisdom, and pays the mortgage. If, in five years, Google demands A student equivalency, then that's what I'll do.

My hat's off, though, to all those devoted to making the web a better place. Currently, I don't possess much of an altruistic edge. You have my admiration, and, I wish you good luck.

wheel blurted:

Can we not be so virtuous about how others earn a living?

Dude, I was Devil's advocating both sides of the coin, continuing the conversation, not trying to kill it, sheesh.
step away from that 10th cup of coffee!

It's a pros and cons thing, what's the upside and what's the downside.

Obviously, a sharp customer will know a crap page when presented with one and you have the potential to alienate that visitor.

However, if your site is full of AdSense and alienated visitors look for the first click off a page that offends their sensibilities, then it's gonna rock the CTR!