So advertisers on the current system won't be able to see their bids come early December?

not from the bid tool anyway. As far as I understand it your bid goes in, and depending on your ctr, fits you in to the ordering. The interface shows the range for the keyword as a guide for getting the top positions but you wont know what the competition is paying, only what you roughly need to pay to be there. What you pay will also fluctuate around the performance of others. Welcome to the old Google system. Other factors are expected to be introduced later into the ranking mix.

thats right sem4u

The View Bids tool will also no longer be available

and also from here:
[help.yahoo.com...]

When will the changes to the Manage Bids page take effect?

You will see the changes to the Manage Bids page take effect in early December 2006.

I noticed it yesterday. If you go to the Overture Bid Tool you will only see the bids of those who have not yet transitioned to the new interface. Those who have transitioned are no longer listed in the tool results.

is this change happening in the UK too?

I've heard the release of yahoos new search wont be available in the UK til the 2nd quarter of 2007.

Could do with someone clarifying that

I have put in three calls to my rep this week, all have been unreturned. With changes like this and a serious downgrade in service, I am questioning exactly why I continue in my business relationship with Yahoo.

Cabo

yea ive had the we are in meetings feedback too

I guess Yahoo doesn't understand that we are running businesses as well, and actions like this do not make Yahoo a desirable business partner.

This ranks right up there with the "pay us big bucks to review your site. Payment doesn't guarantee it will be indexed, but will get it looked at faster."

I guess some companies didn't learn much from the dot com bust.

I'm in precise agreement with Cabo.

We will find better avenues to explore.

In the era of click fraud concerns this doesn't exactly bolster their credibility and they will feel the backlash, no doubt. I think a lot of us have almost been waiting for such a last straw to justify dumping them.

This is horrible news.

Why would they do this?

I found Overture/Yahoo the easiest to manage and quickest to monitor.

Why would they do this?

Hummm....let me think. Oh ya, MONEY!

Obviously, they are taking a lesson from Google here and it actually makes sense. This way, people with higher click through ratios can move up higher and receive more clicks and earn Yahoo more money.

Plus, they have ads with higher click ratios up higher in the list which is better for users anyways, because obviously those ads are better targeted to what the user is searching for.

This will prevent low CTR ads from hogging top spots. For example, I could bid on the word "car" and run an ad like "Car Accessories from Parts-R-Us". Assuming the ad got through editorial, I could get tons of exposure and some pretty good clicks because of my specific title; I could also expect a low CTR because the title should eliminate car shoppers. I'd displace those bidders with lower bids who were actually selling cars. In the first position, those ads would have had a much higher CTR than my ad, but because I was willing to offer a higher price per click I got the top spot. Google figured out that game a long time ago.

So, will the Overture 'inventory' keywords selection tool go away, too?

I haven't seen anything about it one way or the other, but if they're taking down the view bids tool, it raises the question.

>>>Assuming the ad got through editorial

Maybe they are going to get rid of the editors too.

If the CTR is going to be a basis for ranking. Why would you care what people put in the ads.

Is this just and example of bid management becoming a thing of the past? I figure everybody will be on the google model soon enough...

This is horrible news.

Well, this is an example of horrible implementation for the next month or so, I'll admit, (who's brilliant idea was it to implement this in December, anyway?) but it's necessary for the following reason:

Because those who have transitioned to the new system will not have access to the bid landscape, and those who haven't transitioned would have... creating a disincentive to transition and an advantage for those who don't transition...

i.e. If you've transitioned to the new interface and bid $x per click but can't see competitive bids and I can because i haven't transitioned... I could bid $x - $0.01 and 'jam' you without your knowledge.

Beyond the messy month of December, this is a very welcome change IMHO - for the reasons stated by several other posters. If you're relevant and have been outpriced and pushed around by crap sites all these years, how can you not love having other criteria (like CTR) factored into the price and ranking?

This is exactly what the new MSN AdCenter has done as well. A little less control, but overall a good system. It is just taking some time to get use to.

Yahoo is such an embarrassment. It's clear to me that Yahoo is run by a bunch of Yahoos. With this new update, all they have done is slapped lipstick on a pig.

The fundamental problem with yahoo still exists and until they give advertisers the creative freedom to market as google does then I'm not going to waste anymore time with them.

Agree, they clearly have got involved in so much other stuff, they have lost their focus on search, and I am talking from experience as an advertiser and a UK partner. From the partner perspective (we have content match results appearing on our finance pages) it is simply unbelievable how little communication we get from them.

We have no idea of UK timetables for the switch nor have we had the tiniest morsel of information on the new system. Most emails and calls don't get answered - this is an amazing way to treat a business that has brought them 6 figures of net annually.

My bidding software automatically puts me in the positions that I want. I wonder how this will be affected by these changes.

Jam2005,

Quite simply, the system you're using won't work on Yahoo anymore. Rules-based systems aren't capable of modeling data, yet modeling data is now a requirement going forward with the opaque marketplaces Google, MSN and now Yahoo operate.

-Shorebreak

Beyond the messy month of December, this is a very welcome change IMHO - for the reasons stated by several other posters. If you're relevant and have been outpriced and pushed around by crap sites all these years, how can you not love having other criteria (like CTR) factored into the price and ranking?

The negative side being that there will be no bargains any more. With the way broad match is set to change you will most likely be competing with a lot more listings which will push the price right up.

I'm seeing signs here in the UK that broad match is finding more listing. You can say goodbye to any little nuggets that your competitors haven't found yet, they'll start appearing with broad match.

[edited by: MyWifeSays at 9:52 pm (utc) on Dec. 3, 2006]

The negative side being that there will be no bargains any more. ... You can say goodbye to any little nuggets that your competitors haven't found yet, they'll start appearing with broad match.

terrible news as I live for those. :(

only good thing is I bet it will take a while to hit Korea. Overture has much bigger problems here.

>Quite simply, the system you're using won't work on Yahoo anymore. Rules-based systems aren't capable of modeling data...

Ermmm - not totally true - should be "some rules based systems etc....."

>>Quite simply, the system you're using won't work on Yahoo anymore.

The bid system is already updated for the changes to Yahoo. I just need to tell our provider when I'm ready to switch over to Panama and they'll move our sites to the new system.

I hate it and I emailed them why. I have been on this from the beginning with over 500 terms managed. I bid 10-20 at a time and will use variations of phrases when the bidding is too high.

My daily costs have TRIPLED for two of my keywords with the new system. They are at the same bid price, and i am still in the #1 spot. Advanced Match is set to OFF on both the old and new system.