After talking to a lawyer, it sounds like I'll be spending at least $350 for him to tell me to change my name. I can tell by his tone, and the obviousness of "broad view" defined by the patent office of similar trademark names, that I'm the loser here.

My name really isn't that important right now. I just need a name to operate under and and build my presence. I missed a good opportunity because I run as a common dba street vendor. BS I say!

Is it easy to change a business name later on when it's more established? I really don't have time for this right now. It took me a long time to get my loser name going in all aspects. Now I'm going to choose a new name based only on it's infringementless qualities, then later on do it all again with branding in mind. I found a new name (that doesn't come up in any search) I can live with for awhile, but it is weak where as my last choice was strong.

with branding in mind. I found a new name (that doesn't come up in any search) I can live with for awhile, but it is weak where as my last choice was strong.

If you want to market anything, you need a brand. Get that part done FIRST, else you'll be working for someone else (in that you'll not max your efforts, might be diluted, might fail). Sometimes a "keyword" brand works (though most keywords are already in use and have been for decades) but most often an invented word wins the day (ie. think "Google"). Put some effort in this as what you do from here on out hinges on that.

Thanks tangor, what you say is so true! I have already been trying to make up words. I feel like everything is going to lay in wait for months - even a year, right when I was ready to kick things into the next gear. Maybe I'll get lucky and come up with something that feels good in the next few weeks.

It's like I'm stranded somewhere far away with no way to communicate, and now way to get home.

On another note, if I'm truly going to ride solo, this needed to happen before getting off the bus. My previous name may have felt strong for my needs, but it still had serious weaknesses (obviously).

Still, I know in the back of my head that sometime down the road, the perfect name, logo, brand idea will pop into my head and I'm going to want to start over again. I can't force myself to come up with the best brand idea for myself in a limited amount of time. You know, it's my company; it's like a child. For a customer, you do it until the customer shows true happiness or satisfaction (or they stop paying you). For my empire it'll never b right, since all my work for myself is free. But on the other side, many businesses make buckets 'o money that have really lousy branding.

Well, I think you need a different lawyer. I wouldn't give up on this and schedule out some time to put into it.

You can't trademark specific words, but you can trademark words that are by definition "non-words" like SealAWidget or something. You can trademark phrases, but it gets into areas that are often contestable.

I trademarked someone's logo and here's my experience. I am not a lawyer but the online trademark process is very specific and it won't let you "mess up." We trademarked a mark *and* a specific phrase, her company name. Part of the registration is that it's only registered with the two together, one without the other is NOT registered. You need a separate reg. for each.

Any combination of phrases that come close are contestable by her (now.) That's a whole different gray area though, and you have to police it yourself or pay someone to do it. That is, someone can come in and apply for a TM that's infringing. Exact matches are usually flagged right off and you can't continue. If it's not an exact match but close, and we don't catch it during the publication period and it gets registered, now you're looking at muchos dinero to get it repealed. Oppositions that are deemed valid during the publication period don't cost you anything other than filing fees, if you can prove the infringement (well, unless you use a lawyer to oppose.)

Here's the rub, what a lot of people don't know: once you get your application straight, a trademark lawyer is assigned to your case for review. So it's going through a lawyer ANYWAY. If they find anything too gray, they will return it as not acceptable without modification, and they will point to the documentation, without further elaboration, which is why lawyers are needed here. Ours was rejected twice, because I didn't grok the language. It was something like, "specify the colors of the mark in all aspects (paraph.)" As it turned out, I hadn't specified the colors that would apply to the typography. A change of three words in the app. and it was accepted.

Once accepted, it is published for opposition. During this period, had there been any previous mark holder with a similar mark (there wasn't,) they could have contested it and off you go to court (or withdraw the claim.) Once the publication period expires, it's registered, you can use the circle-R with pride (and stand behind it, unlike most of the marks you see,) and you receive the 10 year cert. It takes about a year to complete.

Having a lawyer doesn't speed up the process, it just means you don't have to know what the legalese means. Having done it, I'm glad I did, though it hurt my head, a lot. :-)

Hi rocknbil. I'm not even going for trademark right now, just trying to register llc at state level. But your reply makes me think a bit more.

My company is "widegets blue", the other company is just "widgets" so to speak. We both do the same thing, except the other is way more established.

I've actually been working on another name. No reference to it out there anywhere whatsoever. The only problem: my old name was like "strong widgets". The new name, while elegant, is more like pretty soft widgets with wings. It's emasculating, but it's original and the new logo is looking super cool. It will change the way I do business though.

I may check out another lawyer. I only called one. Thanks!