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pictures of book or magazine covers

can they be used without pemission?

         

annej

5:38 am on Oct 1, 2006 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



I'm thinking of a booklet written about 1970. I am sure it would be impossible to find anyone to give me permission to use it. Yet I suppose it would still be against copyright.

mzanzig

3:29 pm on Oct 1, 2006 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



annej:

I am not a copyright lawyer, but this looks a bit shady to me. It depends on the way you are going to use the booklets. If you do high-resolution scans and full-text OCR and present the whole text, it's almost for sure that you can't use the content. If you do just a thumbnail scan of the cover and use a lot own content around, you might get away with it because it could be viewed as "quote" for review purposes and might fall under the "fair use" clause.

If you are in doubt, I'd suggest that you do not use the content. Magazines and booklets are copyright protected, and the publisher or the authors might get after you. I guess that you should look up the authors and contact them directly.

Green_Grass

4:06 pm on Oct 1, 2006 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Why is it a problem using scanned images of books on a website? Almost all book stores selling new books or old rare books do this regularly. Do they get permission from all the authors?

I donot think it is a problem.

annej

4:22 pm on Oct 1, 2006 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



I use book covers all the time that I am selling through Amazon. It appears it is fine to show book covers if you are offering it for sale. But in this case the book is no longer available even as used.

It would be just a little larger than a thumbnail and would be by text talking about the how the picture on the cover is an example of the aspsect of history that the article would be about. I could footnote it like I would do a quote.

jimbeetle

4:38 pm on Oct 1, 2006 (gmt 0)

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text talking about the how the picture on the cover is an example of the aspsect of history that the article would be about

That would appear to fall directly under "fair use." From copyright.gov [copyright.gov]:

"Under the fair use doctrine of the U.S. copyright statute, it is permissible to use limited portions of a work including quotes, for purposes such as commentary, criticism, news reporting, and scholarly reports."

But, as I ain't no lawyer...

mzanzig

4:55 pm on Oct 1, 2006 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Green_Grass:

Why is it a problem using scanned images of books on a website? Almost all book stores selling new books or old rare books do this regularly. Do they get permission from all the authors?
I do not think it is a problem.

It's more a question of context. If a publisher sees additional sales from the image, he should not mind the usage. Then again, please note that many author photographs carry the copyright information next to the photo - a clear indication that trouble is underway when using the image.

Then again, if the presentation is fully out-of-context or a blatant re-use, say the full OCR of the book, maybe even with added AdSense on top of each page, then it's quite likely that they go after you...!

Unless you live in a country that does not care about copyright (e.g. Russia, China), you should think very well about whether or not you use others' works to beef up your site.

Just my $0.02

Green_Grass

5:15 pm on Oct 1, 2006 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



I donot understand. If I want to sell a used book, and I go to ebay, I can put an image. Ebay allows it and I do it every few days. I am allowed to sell a used book by showing the image. It is allowed everywhere.

Maybe not in your country?

annej

5:41 pm on Oct 1, 2006 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



I think you are right GG. As long as you are selling the book it's fine. I often do double use. I use the cover as an illustration but also link it to the book at Amazon.

I think I will go ahead and use the covers as illustrations with creditto the publisher. The two I'd like to use are great examples of the topic during the time period. 1970s

Quadrille

6:04 pm on Oct 1, 2006 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



If it's the whole cover, and the use is related to the magazine - selling it, reviewing it or whatever about it - then I see no problem; it's fair use.

But if, for example, the cover contained a picture of Scarlett Johansson, and the use is simply a picture of Scarlett, then you may have a problem, as fair use would not be so easy - particularly if you cropped any of the cover to enlarge Scarlett.

Fair use depends on the use!

stapel

6:26 pm on Oct 1, 2006 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Context makes a big difference.

If you are showing a low-resolution picture of the book to illustrate the particular edition of the copy you are selling, then this is a non-competing, transformative, and limited "use" of the cover art. (You aren't using the cover art of a novel as the cover art of your own novel; you are creating an illustration for a sale, and using the graphic to clear up any potential confusion about the item being offered. And the graphic will be deleted as soon as the sale ends or is completed.)

If, as the original poster seems to imply, you are using a scan of the cover art to illustrate an historical discussion, then this is a non-competing, transformative, and educational "use". (You are using the picture to illustrate how X was used in the context of Y in time-period Z, as proved by the assumptions made when creating the cover art of the book.)

If, on the other hand, you are providing high-resolution scans of the entire work, or perhaps converting the printed work into a PDF file, and then selling the work entire, then this would not be transformative. (You would be using the for-sale novel as a for-sale novel, but you do not own the rights to sell the work. Your "use" would be non-transformative and would under-cut the market of the owners.)

It sounds like the original poster is wanting to make transformative and educational use of a limited portion of the "work". While written permission would be great, if the owner cannot be located, then there would seem to be little one could do. However, if the graphic is going to be posted openly (on the Internet), it might be nice if a little note were included at the bottom of the page, mentioning that contact from the copyright owners, if such exist, would be appreciated.

The above is just my opinion, of course; I'm not a lawyer, and I could be wrong.

Eliz.

mzanzig

6:12 pm on Oct 2, 2006 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Just imagine someone who takes a copyright protected booklet, does high-resolution scans of all images and also does a full OCR of each page. Then this guy puts all this on a web page, complete with Google Adsense on it, maybe also a link to Amazon to buy the book (with kickback to the publisher).

You still think this use is OK? I don't.

buckworks

6:27 pm on Oct 2, 2006 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Administrator 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



You're right, mzanzig, but that scenario is very different from the use annej would be making of the cover image.

annej

10:55 pm on Oct 2, 2006 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



I feel pretty comfortable now, especially since one aspect of the article talks about the influence of books and magazines during this period.